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Emails From Kage Games KG Dogfighting Fans!

Some of the many emails we have gotten since our launch...

I LOVE your description of this app! As an animal lover (not PETA-level,
just get-my-pets-from-the-shelter) I was initially horrified by it, but you
made your points so compellingly that I almost bought it just to support you
and the causes to which you contribute. But I read the comments and decided
against it because I'd want to actually play it - and except for diehard
gangster and redneck types, players panned the game. Sorry!! But, again,
your description was a work of art. : )
-----------------------------

Hello, 
 
My name is Evan Geiger and I've been following the story, or should I say hysteria
revolving around your game and I just wanted to personally say I hope you find the
fortitude to stand your ground, I understand that humaniacs such as folks affiliated
with PETA and the HSUS can be relentless but by giving into their insane antics it
only goes to further their agenda. 
 
The fact that they can sit there with a straight face and try to make you out to be
some kind of monster when there are games out like Grand Theft Auto and Call of Duty
is disgusting, they want to lump dog fighting in with pedophilia the fact that they
can't draw the line or see the difference between a game that involves cyber dogs in
imaginary fights only goes to show their problems not yours.
 
Lastly I would like to state for the record I am by no means a dog fighter I am
nothing more than a law abiding citizen who thinks some of these people have gone
far over board and need to get a reality check and I thought you could use a word of
encouragement among the many hysterical insults and personal attacks. 
 
Best regards,
 
Evan

-------------------------
As an animal lover i disagree with the content in this game but as a game
fan I say keep the game up!  Every time some one gets upset about a game it
has gotten so easy to throw a big enough fit to have it changed or
development stopped  Every time a developer backs down games take a small
step back.

So while I disagree with the content don't let them bully you into taking it
down.  The people against it have been using threats of violence and to back
down from that would be wrong.
------------------------
realize that you have power in this world---why use it this way?suzanne
------------------

When I was 10 every child in america played a game about captureing animals
from the wild, putting them into a  small dark container, never feeding
them, and only letting them out to fight until they became unconcience it
was called pokemon.

-----------------------
Dear Kage games,

I'm sorry for the brutality your corporation is going though. I've seen various
news broadcasts and think its horrible that you have received threats of violence or
worse because you've published this game. I admire the risk you have taken in
making a dog fighting game and applaud your stance on keeping it on the market and
continuing the development of the game. I have not played your game, nor do I plan
on playing it. Honestly, I feel dog fighting to be despicable, an unforgivable
crime. That being said, I believe in free speech and freedom of expression. Gaming
is a fantasy, a break from reality, and should be treated as such no matter the
content. Although I harshly disagree with Dog Wars, I agree with your freedom of
expression. 

Sincerely,

Robert
-------------------------
As a game developer myself, I am disappointed that people do not readily distinguish
 between imagination and reality when playing games.  Tremendous numbers of games
 offend "someone," whether it is shooting police officers, splattering human guts
 all over the screen, depicting illegal drug use, playing the role of a suicide bomber,
 or simply running over pedestrians with cars.  Some countries even have laws banning
 certain manners of creative expression.  Thankfully I do not live in such a country.
  I live in a better country, the USA, whose First Amendment protects the freedom
 of a game developer to creative expression.  The First Amendment is not 
unlimited in freedom, but it certainly applies in this case.  This freedom
 is routinely exercised in books, films, and TV shows, yet for 
some reason people think it's
 ok to pick on games. 

 That an audience can be an active
 rather than a passive participant,

 and yet still act totally within 
the realm of imagination,
 is a powerful idea 
that society at large 
has still largely failed to grasp. 

 I am confident that in a few more generations,
 video games will be so commonplace
 that cultural literacy in the distinction
 will be equally commonplace.
  At least, games will be no more abused
 than books or films on First Amendment grounds.

  That is not the present,
 and shame on Google if they yank the game
 just because some people find it offensive.

The game developers themselves
 do not condone actual dog fighting, 
and unlike some, 
have the ability to distinguish
 fantasy from reality.  
Feel free to boycott whatever you want,
 but I can think of more creative ways to
 put pressure on Kage Games to do something responsible
 with their media attention.

  For instance, they could
 donate some proceeds to a dog charity,
 put a disclaimer on the title screen of the game,
 put some statements about how horrible animal cruelty is in the game...

 or for all I know maybe they've done
 some of that with their authorial voice already.

  I haven't played the game.

Even if they want to do something 
totally "disgusting and irresponsible"
 I will defend their right to do it.
  I do not believe in the Thought Police,
 and I don't want them coming for my own thought.
  Who knows what other 
thought and creative expression 
will be outlawed or banned
 if the political climate allows people
 to think it's ok to do so?

  Will it be your religion?
  Your political candidates?
  Your beliefs about warfare or pacifism?
  Your attitudes about child rearing?
  Who will draw these lines
, and why should people be allowed to draw these lines for you?


FROM: THE KAGE GAMES TEAM:::
THANKS, that is art right there

-------------------

Thank you for your reply.  First, I would never advocate violence against you or
your employees and those animal advocates that do are not representing the majority
of us.  I am happy to know that you are developing this app with the goal of
educating the public on the horrors of dog fighting.  

Yes, censorship is indeed a slippery slope. No one has censored you.  What you have
is an outcry from animal lovers who can't comprehend any game that is based on dog
fighting can be anything other than a bad idea.  Is the intent to educate?  Really? 
I have attached a picture of a real victim of dog fighting who really wanted nothing
to do with it as most don't. At one time he must have been a good looking dog.  The
second picture is of a dog that I rescued. She had been used as a bait dog when she
was a puppy. She was saved from that life in time and I suppose Smiley could be
considered safe now but what has he suffered?

I implore you to really think this through. Even if this is going to raise money to
help real dogs please consider how kids learn. IF they become de-sensitized to dog
fighting through your app then you have potentially created a whole new generation
of real dog fighters. 

Thank you for your consideration.  



Linda

"The greatness of a nation and it"s moral progress can be judged by the way it's
animals are treated."



-----------------

Its sucks that google removed dog wars before I found out about it. Google
should have some kind of parental control for the market but instead they
made a publicity stunt so people would think they are doing the right thing.
People are responsible for their own actions  if they fight dogs then they
obviosly too immature. just cause I play weed farmer and garden of weeden
didnt mean I have pot plants in my closet. I hope this shit gets worked out
so you can do your thing. I have never played but I bet its  fun. I wonder
what they would do if its was people fighting to the death instead of dogs.
Good luck-james
---------------------------

A friend of mine referred this app to me but unfortunately I was too late due to the
app being removed. I was hoping you could send me the file or a download link so I
could play the app for myself. Thanks for reading and please let me know what's up
if the app will be coming back either from you or into the market. Thanks

-----------------------------

I think this is horrible, but we both know it won't  desensitize anyone to animal
violence or make anyone try this out in real life

So, you suck - but this is america, and it's your right to do, say and create things
that some people may find offensive - stick with your guns about this one and don't
give in - allowing this to be censored would be much more offensive to me than the
app is itself

Remember, the same rights that  allow people to bitch about this are the ones that
allow you to produce it

May I suggest a gay marriage app as the sequel to this?  :-)

-------------------------

I am with you in your creation of this game.  I've seen many games like
Saints Row 1 and 2 which is about joining a gang and ruling the gang
underworld. If that and all these other games that "teach young kids to do
bad thing" are out why not this game.  If parents allow young kids to play
it then that the parents wrong doing not you as the creator.  There is a
rating of mature meaning it is only for those old enough to understand that
it is fictional and the real dof fighting is wrong.  Facebook has several
games that ANYONE can join like Weedvillle, Mob Wars, Drug Wars, and many
more.  Don't back down, keep up your fight for your freedom of speech and
exchange of ideas. KEEP IT UP!!!

-- 
Sprouts
------------------------------


ok, 
 
i read your auto response and I am apologizing for my earlier email.  I too went to 
the "rape" scenario because the notion of a game that is based on control and
violence and pain against an unwilling individual for personal pleasure - embodies
the element of rape. It is interesting that people are going to that dark place.    
now maybe you can develop a game that is so sophisticated that kids playing it 
 and they will - will end the game with a realization that even if they "won" they
actually lost because virtual animals are injured.  I think it is a very fine line, you are 
walking - even if you donate to animal orgs to stop animal sport fighting if you are 
encouraging it through the app.   and I do believe in free speech but with it comes 
responsibilty and making something a game does not diminish the responsibility .
 
although I sent an detractor email,  I would never countenance violence against
people so I am truly sorry the company members and family have been threatened. 
One can hate the game app, but to threaten people is simply wrong, illegal and
counterproductive.    Anyone making such threats are hypocrites and people who
shouldn't be playing virtual reality games that rest on violence.

-------------------
Come on...I just downloaded the app and was setting up my Guy and it said connection
pool shut down. I really wanted to play this game and don't see why it should b
taken off the market. Sounds like a bunch of haters out there. I mean its ok to have
games where people shut other people but not games where dogs fight...really? Lets
get this game back up and running! 


Thanks,

Wayne Inglett
-------------------------
I would love to play this game but im a female.   So whats up no female
characters for me to choose.  hey chicks love to play these type games also.

MS Paradise

-------------------

I love this game simply love it I play this game all day everyday but I hate the
fact that I am training my dog so hard and gettin my cred up and dudes with 0 wins 2
losses 47 EXP 15 cred beat me, atleast 15 of my 22 losses have been to scrubs both
my EXP and cred are above 1,000 what is the business with that I know its a beta but damn bro lol

---------------------------
great game hope to see lots of great things for dog wars in the future I
support this game 100%
---------------------

It would be cool if we could see others players profiles and have more than
one dog. also change dog color and more accesories. exelent app as is thanx
----------------

People are over reacting, it is just a game, nit saying I agree with it in
real life but come in, its ok to play an assassin game where there are cut
scenes of you blowing a mans brains out at point blank, but this isn't ok?
Its all fake and if you don't like it then don't download the app right? I
think you guys have every right to develop this app.
---------------------

i agree that dogfighting is wrong but you guys have just made a game. i would just
like to say that i agree with your statement 
"
It is just A VIDEO GAME
Perhaps one day we will make gerbil wars or beta fish wars for people who can't
understand fantasy role play games
Just because something is illegal in real life in certain countries, does not mean
it is illegal to make a song, movie, or video game about it (looking at you XDA
Developer Forums... deleting our beta testing thread and banning our account?!)
Just go slingshot some virtual birds to kill some virtual pigs.
Go complain to someone who cares about Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Weed Farmer,
Smoke a Bowl (these two are listed in the top 15 of casual games on Android Market)
and maybe even Sierra's Leisure Suit Larry from 1987.
This is listed as a HIGH MATURITY app, and does NOT violate the Terms of Use with
the Google market in any way!!!"

i say do whats right and ignore the masses, there just a bunch of no lifers who sit
around at home all day and need to get out more! 

i in NO WAY support dogfighting what soever!!!

--------------------

I choose not to download based on theme but that is _my_ choice and not 
to be abridged by the idiots I have read on this topic to date.

-----------------------

I know, your getting spammed for making the app and how bad it is, and i don't
support dog fighting but, people are being a lil radical, they are saying that you
should go to hell for that app but, in reality, they accept games that involve
killing people and things in great detail, like they literally have body parts
flying everywhere, and killing animals (Black Ops, GTA, Modern Warfare 2) yet people
buy it in enormous quantities, they should realize that, where are their morals in
that? Exactly...
----------------------

I played the game its a hott game fuck what people say they hypocrites cause this
the same people that go to their cribs & play grand theft auto with their kids next
to them while smokin & drinkin.... People are dumb
------------------------

Hey guys. I know what kindof heat you guys get from dog wars. It takes balls
to publish that kind of game. I know for aa fact that tthere are hundreds of
other games on the market that shouldn't be there, but hell they're still
there. Just keep at it.
-------------------------

dear developers of Dog Wars
   i am just writing in support of your right to be in the android market. while i
will probably never play your game, i do respect your right to be in the market.
for some 'professional writer" on some website to write an entire article to
attempt to get you(maybe only this game, i dont know) is ludicrous with all the
other crap that is in the market, and not getting a word said about it. you have
my 100% support, and kudos to you for making an app that is ruffling a few
feathers, and not giving to shits about what anyone else thinks...


Mark
--------------------

Hey there. Well, while I can't pretend like I'm not a little unsettled by
your application, I want you to know that as a fellow application developer,
I support you. I'm sure you're already doing this, but keep your head high
and don't back down. If I was to get banned for demonstrating my
comprehension of the first amendment, I'd raise hell and I hope you are.

Good luck with any and all future endeavours. Controversy or not, I know how
much time gets dedicated into app development and I salute you, sir.

------------------------

I just wanna say keep up the good work. Fuck the ignorant, stupid people
that just want to bitch  and complain about stupid shit. Honestly I haven't
seen or used this “dog fighting” application, but i seen all the uproar
about it and felt like I guys could use a positive remark and keep pushing
boundaries! Open source is open source and haters gonna hate. I guys should
make an abortion application too just to piss em off more! That is all.

------------------------------
You are a insightful person. This game could help those type of people that
want to do harm. It also gives them an avenue to let there sick rational out
without hurting anything.

I personally appreciate your willingness to keep these people entertained in
a virtual environment.
-----------------------------

No matter what anyone says, this game is awesome been playing it and it's
amazing. People just need to realize that you guys haven't done any of this
and it is all made up. Look at Call of Duty, that game has you killing
PEOPLE, no one says a damn thing. Feel free to quote me on this, I believe
everyone just thinks some people are mentally retardes and just assumes they
will start abusing their dog etc. No one complains about Grand Theft Auto or
Halo, but this tiny little game available to a couple of million people who
actually own the platform seems to stick out. Keep up the great work, I
enjoy the game very much, and I have no intentions of ever turning my little
Yorkie into a demonic killing machine

---------------------

Ignore the trolls & flames of the hypocrites & liars. Keep doing what you're
doing ^^ If anything I think it's a good thing.
I think there should be other games of this sort, mainly because I noticed
that humans don't like seeing what happens in real life brought to the
light, really reflects on the world as it is.

Good job and continue 'ruffling feathers'.
-Max

-------------------------

I'm sure you may not get around to reading this among the onslaught of mail
you will be getting. On the off chance you do, I'd like to commend your app
for pushing for free speech in mobile development. If developers and users
don't set these precedents then large corporations and publishing houses
will. Keep it up

--------------------------
I have always felt that do what you want just as long as you do not inflict your
views on other people which you are not doing so i do not see why everybody is going
crazy. Its the same as child porno. everyones against it as should be but you would
never make a game for it. Dog fighting in a game mode is accepted in many countrys
as is the real thing so the people that are going crazy should give those people
the right to play the game and enjoy their chosen sport. You can use this comment if
you like.


---------------------------

i was gonna send hatemail about your dogfighting game but then read your
disclaimer. Good point. So nevermind. The end
--------------------------

Hey,

I am sure you are aware by now that your game has made it on android central
and are receiving quite the negative response.

I think the game may be in a bit of bad taste from a general perspective but
I believe in an open market and the ability to ignore something one is not
interested in.

I can see the game is simply a game and people need to learn to not get
offended so easily. They always have the option to not download it, in the
same sense that vegetarians can simply not eat meat.

I wish you the best in this soon to come mess and I hope Google remains
independent from the contents of the app store, at least in silly situations
like this.

-Sky
------------------------

XXXXXXX gave out your email address so people could "Let 'em know
how you feel. And tell 'em we sent ya." Well, I feel like I have no interest
in playing your video game, but I fully support you in your work and hope
you continue. The very fact that Android Central would advocate google
inventing a new term of use you have broken so your app can be pulled from
the market is disgusting and a shocking display of how poor the state of
journalism is in the technology market. Keep going strong and remember there
are people out there who understand the difference between reality and
fiction, not everyone is a total moron like PXXX NXXXXXXXX.


-Shanan L


---------------------------------------


Ben wrote:


Wait, you guys are donating money to a charity? That was not something
covered in the original article that I saw. I'll admit, I didn't do much
research.

Clearly I support you guys and don't cast stones without warrant. If there's
a bigger story to cover here, I'm all ears.

Personally I'm a big fan of the Android Market's openness, spam and malware
included.

> The Pitboss wrote:

> Ben,
>
> The best response to the XXXXXXXXXX article was this:
>
> "Very irresponsible post for a news site to promote censorship. Good job."
>
> Why don't people get it? This is not at all about dogfighting. We do not
> condone it and have rescued dogs ourselves. This is a satire (southpark
> style) and we actually have a cause.
>
> Please email back if you are interested in our higher point, we clearly
> are a well funded, educated and talented team... raising money for dogs
> with electrons is not a bad cause, right?
>
> The Pitboss
>
>
>
>> I have yet to play the Dog Wars game (downloading now), but I saw the
>> article on Android Central and had to say something. Fuck the haters,
>> the more haters you have the more successful you are. Keep up what
>> you're doing and don't let a bunch of nuts stand in your way.
>>
>> On another note, I write for www.theandroidsite.com and I may have to
>> throw up a post of my own. If you guys have any official statement or
>> anything, I'd love to add it to a post.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Ben
>>
>
>

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